DEAR DR. NERDLOVE: Let me apologize in advance for rambling. There’s a lot to tell and I desperately need to vent, but I’ll try to stick to the pertinent points.
The background: I (cis straight woman) met ‘Ray’ (cis straight man) five years ago when we worked together. We are not kids. I’m divorced and he’s been married twice and has adult children. We began seeing each other. Things were ok. I knew it wasn’t something I wanted long-term, but it was ok for the meantime. I loved him, but I wasn’t in love with him. We dated for almost two years. We both contributed to the breakup. For his part, he had a tendency to lie and break promises. For my part, I fell into a deep depression the second year and basically was M.I.A. I also had a physical issue that drastically reduced the opportunities for sex. Things officially ended Xmas 2018 when he broke yet another promise and ghosted for a few weeks. While the split wasn’t really amicable, it wasn’t super hostile either. There was no argument or anything. I was simply done, and I think we both knew the relationship had been on life support. He’d text once in a while and I’d almost always ignore him. When my dad died in 2019, I texted and told him. His mom had died a year before and we had both been close to our parents. We began to occasionally text each other after that, and earlier this year we began actually talking on the phone. Now, it’s important that I be perfectly clear: I have no interest in rekindling any romantic or sexual relationship with Ray. I began talking to him again because I missed his friendship. I always enjoyed talking to him and feel I can be myself with him. I do have love for him and he makes no secret that he cares for me.
Thing is, Ray is sexist. He’s not a misogynist. He doesn’t hate or have any animosity towards women. He does have some outdated ridiculous ideas about women, men, and relationships. Admittedly, this is not news to me. I knew this when we dated. I’m a feminist, but as in all things, I pick my battles. There were times I challenged him and we had many convos about his beliefs. Make no mistake, I’m definitely someone who will challenge someone. But I’ve been known to let my intensity get the better of me and it’s not always pleasant. Also, I didn’t feel it was my responsibility to change him. Mostly because I knew I couldn’t. It’s clear to me his beliefs are truly ingrained. His dad died when he was very young, so his teen and preteen brothers probably taught him about the birds and the bees. (And I don’t think his dad would have done much better had he lived. I won’t go into details, but there was a definite ick factor to his parents’ marriage.)
Ray believes women are silly emotional creatures that will swoon and drop their drawers for any male that whispers some bulls--t in their ears. He doesn’t believe men and women can be platonic friends. Any time men and women have any contact for non business reasons, it’s because somebody’s trying to f--k somebody. Says he doesn’t need female friends because he has no interest in discussing soap operas (always said with a snicker). He has male friends to discuss sports and women with. He believes women don’t leave relationships unless they’re leaving for another man. He thinks women are better equipped to tolerate a cheating partner because we’re used to it (please know that these are all his words, not mine). He also describes certain cars as “lady cars” (also said with a snicker).
I think you know where this is going. Ray hits on me pretty regularly when we talk (we haven’t seen each other in person since reconnecting). An ex flirting normally would not bother me, but knowing how he thinks makes it gross. Worse, he’s blunt (probably due to the fact we’ve been intimate before) and soooo f--king juvenile. He regularly starts talking about his dick. Out of the f--king blue! I wanna scream “mf’er are you 12???” He constantly talks about how important it is to men that they can get it up. As often as he talks about sex and the importance of dicks working, he almost never mentions anything about women’s pleasure or needs. It’s like the woman doesn’t matter at all. She’s an afterthought. For some reason, he’s always telling me some story about guys who’s wives/girlfriends got caught cheating. I have no f--king idea why he’s obsessed with these stories and why he tells me. To be honest, I don’t know if I believe him. I think he imagines that s--t just to justify (in his mind) his objectification of women.
I find myself constantly rolling my eyes and cringing. The eye rolling is bad enough, but a friend making me cringe is a problem. I do not flirt with him and I shoot him down every time. I’ve had to awkwardly change the subject many times. I challenge him and I’ve found myself becoming pretty angry. What’s weird is that sometimes it seems he’s doing it because he thinks that’s what he ought to do. Like, he finds himself enjoying a regular ordinary conversation with me and then he remembers ‘oh, this is a woman. I should be trying to screw her’. Honestly? I never enjoyed sex with him due to his childish approach to sex. He wasn’t inexperienced. He was just too giddy and giggly. Like a 15yr old who unexpectedly got lucky for the first time.
I’m ready to tell him my version of the birds and the bees. I don’t think he’ll like it. And that’s part of the problem. Other than the sex stuff, I enjoy talking to him. He’s down to earth and good natured. We have similar backgrounds and share some life views. And, admittedly, I’m going through some things and I’m kinda lonely for friends. I worry that the crudeness is so much a part of who he is, that telling him to stop would be asking him to not be himself. I don’t know if that’s fair.
But I’m becoming more and more angry. Not just for myself but because I know how objectification harms women. It pisses me off that he thinks I would engage in that with him. Today I called him out on how he always talks about women cheating but never says anything about men cheating. He said it’s because it’s commonplace for men to cheat. A few weeks ago, he expected me to agree that a woman wasn’t marriage material because she has a foursome with three men. He said she was a whore. I asked him what that made the men. He didn’t get my point.
I know I rambled and got off track. I hope you can figure out all the questions (asked and unasked). Can this friendship be saved? Should I even try? Thanks in advance.
– Sick of the Sexism
DEAR SICK OF THE SEXISM: Here’s my question for you, SotS: why, exactly, are you still friends with this guy? This is the friendship equivalent of what I call the Big Butt issue: “everything’s great, my partner’s amazing… now someone call Sir Mixx-A-Lot because here comes a big ‘…BUT!’ that’s gonna negate everything I said before”.
Case in point: you say you miss his friendship and you can be yourself around him… BUT he’s also a sexist asshole who can’t stop hitting on you or saying heinous s--t.
I’m gonna be honest, SotS: you say he’s not a misogynist because he doesn’t actively hate women… but he sure as s--t seems to think they’re inferior. I mean, when every joke is about how women are “silly emotional creatures” who only care about soap operas, will bang any dude who asks the right way and who can’t stand to be single (but also will put up with cheaters), it’s one of those moments where you have to wonder how many of those are actually jokes. Because frankly, either he does this to wind folks up, in which case there’s no point in engaging with him, or he’s serious, in which case there’s REALLY no point to engage with him at all.
And then there’s the fact he seems to think that your not being into him is a thing that he can fix if he just, I dunno, badgers you until you hit your killscreen or something.
So I think the big question is: what, exactly, are you getting out of this? You say you’re going through some s--t and missing having friends. I totally get that; feeling isolated and lonely sucks and sometimes you’ll reach for any port in a storm. But at the same time, it seems like being his friend has a far higher cost than whatever benefits you’re getting from having him in your life. Are you sure that he’s bringing more to the metaphorical table than just being a body you can shove into the hole in your life marked “friends”? Because, quite frankly, you deserve better than a guy who, at best, is the social equivalent of chewing on aluminum foil.
While I realize maybe you need something to keep you distracted or help you work through whatever s--t you’re going through, but if you really need a project… maybe get some LEGO sets? Remodel your apartment? Build increasingly elaborate s--t in Minecraft? Foster a puppy or two? Because this dude ain’t so much of a fixer-upper as a “gut the interior and start over”, and you’re not getting paid to teach him how not to be a d--kbag.
If you were to do anything, (why, tho?) then I’d say the only thing to do is pull him up short the next time he makes a crack. Not even in an “educate him why he’s wrong” sense but in a “quit saying that s--t around me, ever” sense. Same with his hitting on you: shut him down so hard it’s like you just blew up the shield generator on the forest moon of Endor: “I don’t want you flirting with me, I don’t want you hitting on me, we are never, ever going to be even in the same zipcode of being naked together again and I don’t care if it’s ‘just a joke’, that s--t isn’t funny now knock it the f--k off.”
But, honestly? I wouldn’t expect much from that. The unfortunate truth is that even in this day and age, a lot of men only take things seriously if they hear it from other men; hearing it from you just means it’s coming from another “silly emotional creature”. So, y’know. I don’t think you’re gonna see a miraculous, Scrooge-like transformation on Christmas Day.
If you feel obligated (why tho?), I wouldn’t say look at this as fixing him. I’d suggest looking at this as the parting shot as you go out the door so that maybe he learns that his behavior has consequences, and if he wants women in his life, he needs to not be such a d--kbag.
Good luck.
Please send your questions to Dr. NerdLove at his website (www.doctornerdlove.com/contact); or to his email, doc@doctornerdlove.com