life

The Ongoing Honorific Debate

Miss Manners by by Judith Martin, Nicholas Ivor Martin and Jacobina Martin
by Judith Martin, Nicholas Ivor Martin and Jacobina Martin
Miss Manners | November 26th, 2022 | Letter 1 of 3

DEAR MISS MANNERS: How do you address a formal invitation to a married lesbian couple who have the same last name? For example: Lisa Jones and Maggie Jones. Do you write Mrs. and Mrs. Jones? Or Mss. (plural of Ms.) Jones? Or Ms. Lisa Jones and Ms. Maggie Jones?

GENTLE READER: Having lost the grammatical battle of "they/them" -- she is entirely in favor of a nonbinary pronoun, if not the sometimes-confusing plural -- Miss Manners is determined to get ahead of new honorifics.

She will spare you the history lessons about Mrs. being short for Mistress -- which eventually took on nefarious tones, as so many female monikers do -- and about Ms. being historically correct centuries ago, not just a 20th-century feminist invention.

Oh, look at that: She did not spare you the lecture after all.

She therefore humbly suggests: "the Mses Jones."

Lest you retort that Ms. is not for married ladies, it is. It just does not define a woman as married or not. That ought to quell all of those other rightful patriarchal objections.

With this particular surname, you could also just say "the Joneses," but she begs you to resist "the Mses Joneses," as fun as it might be to say.

life

Miss Manners for November 26, 2022

Miss Manners by by Judith Martin, Nicholas Ivor Martin and Jacobina Martin
by Judith Martin, Nicholas Ivor Martin and Jacobina Martin
Miss Manners | November 26th, 2022 | Letter 2 of 3

DEAR MISS MANNERS: My spouse and I have different techniques for adding ketchup to french fries. My spouse pours an amount of ketchup onto an empty area near the fries and then dips them. I pour the ketchup directly onto the fries. Does etiquette have a preference?

GENTLE READER: Nope, it does not really care. Once fingers enter the food arrangement, etiquette gets less picky. Unless, Miss Manners warns, you are sharing the fries -- in which case, she recommends whichever method does not bring you to blows.

life

Miss Manners for November 26, 2022

Miss Manners by by Judith Martin, Nicholas Ivor Martin and Jacobina Martin
by Judith Martin, Nicholas Ivor Martin and Jacobina Martin
Miss Manners | November 26th, 2022 | Letter 3 of 3

DEAR MISS MANNERS: I was brought up to offer drinks and/or food to people who come over to my house. I am engaged to a man whose parents do not do this, and I am trying to manage my feelings about it.

I went to their house for a planned visit, without my fiance, when the parents intended to take me out for lunch. I brought them homemade cookies.

Nothing was offered to me during the hour before we left for lunch. When we returned, not having had coffee nor dessert at the restaurant, we spent about 45 minutes at their house before I left. Again, nothing was offered -- not even the cookies I had brought over. They paid for lunch.

Is it unreasonable for me to have expected that they would offer me a drink? Maybe take out the cookies I brought and enjoy them while I was still there? Or was that not appropriate because they took me out for lunch? In my family, this would be considered very rude.

GENTLE READER: Certainly, a drink or light refreshment may be offered when one is visiting another's home. But in your example, with lunch having been so soon on the horizon, Miss Manners is inclined to excuse your in-laws for the transgression. If it happens during a longer interval with no meal promised, you may rightfully consider them thoughtless.

(Please send your questions to Miss Manners at her website, www.missmanners.com; to her email, dearmissmanners@gmail.com; or through postal mail to Miss Manners, Andrews McMeel Syndication, 1130 Walnut St., Kansas City, MO 64106.)

life

Third Baby Shower Feels Excessive

Miss Manners by by Judith Martin, Nicholas Ivor Martin and Jacobina Martin
by Judith Martin, Nicholas Ivor Martin and Jacobina Martin
Miss Manners | November 25th, 2022 | Letter 1 of 2

DEAR MISS MANNERS: I was always under the belief that your first baby shower should also be your only one. But I have now been invited to a third baby shower for my niece, whose oldest child is still very young.

I could understand if there was some space between the kids, since new equipment would be needed, or if this third baby was a different gender. But they are all boys, and her oldest is just 2. This feels like a gift grab.

What do you think? Should I buy another gift and go to the shower? Or is it OK to send my regards, knowing I will still show up with a gift when the baby is born?

GENTLE READER: Showers are gift grabs. That is their sole purpose. But Miss Manners agrees that second and third ones are excessive.

Unfortunately, if you do go, a present is expected. If you do not want to be pressured into shopping from a registry, witnessing endless present-opening and playing unseemly party games, then showing up with a gift after the baby arrives is fine.

Either way, it seems, these parents will get their loot.

life

Miss Manners for November 25, 2022

Miss Manners by by Judith Martin, Nicholas Ivor Martin and Jacobina Martin
by Judith Martin, Nicholas Ivor Martin and Jacobina Martin
Miss Manners | November 25th, 2022 | Letter 2 of 2

DEAR MISS MANNERS: My husband and I enjoy the company of another couple we've known for years. I've had them over for dinner many times.

I eat only plant-based (vegan) foods; however, I make both vegan and meat-based dishes for everyone else. I don't ask them to bring anything, as they are our guests.

A few years ago, we invited them to meet us for dinner at a restaurant, which we planned to pay for. A day before the planned dinner, they called and wanted to invite us to their house rather than eating out. I asked if I could bring anything, and their answer was no.

When dinner at their house was served, it was stew with multiple kinds of meat and no vegetables. Even the salad had bacon in it. The wife said, "I don't think you eat meat, but I hope you can eat this."

Miss Manners, they have known for years that I don't eat animal products. I picked through the meal as best I could without complaint. Since the pandemic, we haven't gotten together with them.

What are your thoughts on hosts who don't provide any meatless dishes for a longtime friend? As a vegan, I have always made dishes with meat for my guests.

GENTLE READER: That your friends are either thoughtless, inconsiderate or perhaps just forgetful. The latter seems unlikely after all these years, but if you can believe that that is all it is, the friendship might be saved -- if you think it worthwhile.

Miss Manners suggests that next time, you could politely say in advance, "Oh, I can't remember if I told you, but I'm afraid I don't eat meat of any kind. I am happy to bring something, however, if it's hard to separate it for your other guests." And if she once again serves you bacon salad, you will know that the ruse is up.

(Please send your questions to Miss Manners at her website, www.missmanners.com; to her email, dearmissmanners@gmail.com; or through postal mail to Miss Manners, Andrews McMeel Syndication, 1130 Walnut St., Kansas City, MO 64106.)

life

Rich 'Best Friend' Demands Money, Won't Pay It Back

Miss Manners by by Judith Martin, Nicholas Ivor Martin and Jacobina Martin
by Judith Martin, Nicholas Ivor Martin and Jacobina Martin
Miss Manners | November 24th, 2022 | Letter 1 of 2

DEAR MISS MANNERS: I have a best friend of 27 years, and I'm getting very annoyed with her. Every time I invite her to dinner or to an event, she expects me to pay for everything. She has gone as far as asking me for a loan, for groceries, etc.

Being the nice person I am, I will loan her the money and buy her groceries, if I am able. The problem is that she will not repay me. When I confront her, she gets very angry and tells me she is in no position financially to pay me back.

She has a really good job and makes really good money. I am a single mother with only my income, which is not a lot. There was one time that I asked her for gas money, and she went ballistic. She said she doesn't help anybody financially, then stopped talking to me.

She moved in with her sister, only pays $300 in rent and is financially supporting her 27-year-old son -- she pays his rent, car payment, insurance, food, etc.

I have stopped helping her altogether and will not give in anymore. I don't want to lose 27 years of friendship, but I don't want to be her friend if all she's going to do is ask for money. Please help!

GENTLE READER: If friendship were defined by longevity (rather than, say, warmth, kindness or shared interests), we would all have more friends -- without being any better off.

Miss Manners mentions this because none of the acts you describe suggest this is a person with whom you should wish to maintain a relationship for 27 days, much less 27 years.

If she is mistaken, and this person has other endearing qualities, then the repeated requests for money should be refused firmly, directly and without rancor: "I'm sorry. I cannot lend you money for your groceries."

life

Miss Manners for November 24, 2022

Miss Manners by by Judith Martin, Nicholas Ivor Martin and Jacobina Martin
by Judith Martin, Nicholas Ivor Martin and Jacobina Martin
Miss Manners | November 24th, 2022 | Letter 2 of 2

DEAR MISS MANNERS: My daughter deemed my response to an incessantly chattering office cleaner rude.

"D." is a younger person who cleans our office. They routinely eat lunch at the same time I do. I have listened to this individual chatter nonstop for half an hour, detailing to three different people the salad they ate last week, or the woes they have with a reprehensible roommate. I've seen this person continue blathering even after a victim walked away from the nonstop, inane chit-chat.

The other day, D. asked me how I was, and I responded, "Fine, thanks." I didn't reciprocate the question, because I needed to get back to work. My daughter believes I should have asked how D. was, then extracted myself with an apology and a "I need to get back to work."

Which one of us has the more mannered response?

GENTLE READER: Let's call them Polite Response B and Polite Response A. Although Miss Manners finds no fault starting with B, it becomes even more blameless when A has already been tried by you -- and abused by D.'s nattering on about C, E, F and G.

(Please send your questions to Miss Manners at her website, www.missmanners.com; to her email, dearmissmanners@gmail.com; or through postal mail to Miss Manners, Andrews McMeel Syndication, 1130 Walnut St., Kansas City, MO 64106.)

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